I had a beautiful post filled with hope already written in my mind about the story of Pinocchio and how Diver Dude picked one out for me in a quaint wood shop in Rome. But events have taken a different turn since Wednesday night.
The past few weeks seemed to be moving in the right direction. We talked, laughed, made love and truly connected the way we used to before this circus started. I felt stronger and more confident than I have in a very long time. Our weekend in Italy was icing on the cake. One perfect night in a small bar in Rome, Diver Dude took my hand to the sound of the italian version of Bob Dylan, looked me in the eyes, and said: "You know sweetie I think we'll get through this, and even though I'm not ready to commit to having a child yet, I really want you to know..." I stopped him with a kiss and asked him to please not say anything before he was ready. And in my heart hope started spreading its wings.
Wednesday night after a single session with Lady Merlin, Diver Dude came home in an agitated state of mind. I turned the TV off and asked him what happened. He told me how hard this all is for him and how much he loves me, but that if he's being true to himself he does not want any more children. That he can't. He may have thought for a moment he could, but he can't. The flutter of hopeful wings grew quiet and instead I felt dark sadness pour back into my heart.
If he has made this final choice and is willing to take the consequences for it, he leaves me with an impossible choice to make.
I could stay with Diver Dude knowing that we will never have children. I will never be a mother. He won't be the father of my children, simply a father to his. I stay with a man I'm madly in love with knowing that it denies me the chance of ever having a family. I'll be with the man I love. Some people search their whole life for true love. I'll have that. But he's a lot older than I am and if nature takes it's course I will be a fairly young widow. I will be alone.
Or.
I could leave the man I love in an effort to have a child and pursue donor sperm IUI. If it's successful I'd be a single mother to a child I wish had a father like Diver Dude. Is it fair to let a child shoulder the burden of his mother leaving the man that should've been his/her dad just to get a chance to become his/her mother? It seems wrong on so many levels.
If it's not successful I'll live my life childless and without Diver Dude. Regardless of the outcome, and possibly in a different way, I will still be alone.
I may find somebody else to love and maybe even have children with, but I truly believe that love like ours come around but once in a lifetime.
It is an impossible choice to make. No matter what choice I make, I'm afraid I'll end up resenting myself once it's too late. No matter how I look at it I don't know what to do.
I'm not a fool. I know that even if Diver Dude against all odds decides to give IVF another go, we might not be successful. I may stlll end up childless. But at least we'd give it a fair chance and that's a risk I'm willing to take. It's the risk I agreed to when I married a man that had had a vasectomy.
For now, I pray for a miracle. I pray for guidance.
And I will get down on my knees.
The beach in Sweden where I grew up.
Photo taken the day I found out our last blast didn't survive the thaw.
Oh cp, my heart aches for the choice you are faced with. I cannot even imagine what walking this path must be like. I wish I had some words of wisdom for you. I'll be thinking of you and praying for you and wishing you some peace.
ReplyDeleteTake care.
This is indeed an impossible decision. I'm so sorry you have to even make this choice.
ReplyDeleteI hope therapy helps you make & be comfortable with whatever decision you make.
I'm sorry you have to do this.
Oh honey, I'm so very sorry. I want to find a villain in this and blame DD for putting you in such a horrible position, but I suppose that you can't blame someone for being true to himself. Is there no room for further discussion? More talks with the super therapist?
ReplyDeleteMy heart just breaks for you. You seem like such a warm and generous person, one who should never be forced into this horrible position. I'm praying that somehow things still work out for you.
Oh girl.... I too am not very good in saying the right thing at a time like this. But know whatever choice you make now, later, when you are ready, go with your heart. Maybe give this a little time and DD will have had more time to make a sure decision. I am thinking of you and will say a prayer for you and DD. Big hugs and kisses and we are all here for you, always my friend. xoxox
ReplyDeleteI am so very very sorry that this is the choice before you. If it helps, at all, I've been in a very very similar one. My first husband - the one I KNEW I'd be with forever & ever - did not want kids. Not ever. I thought I was ok with this. For years & years I thought I could learn to be ok with this. In the end, I wasn't ok with it. But I left, got perspective, got my priorities in order, met a man, fell head-over-heels in love with him, and struggled for 3 years to have a child. I'm 6 mos. pregnant now - using donor eggs. I was too old to have a child using my own past-date eggs. I could not be happier than I am right now.
ReplyDeleteNo moral here - what was right for me would likely not have been right for many people - I just felt that you should know that even though it was the worst, most painful - no, make that the most AGONIZING - decision I ever had to make, I survived it, went on, and found joy again in my life. Feel free to email me off-blog if you need the shoulder of someone who's been where you are. You're in my thoughts during this horrible time.
I am so sorry you are going through this. This is a choice nobody should ever have to make. I have no real advice for you, there is no right now.
ReplyDeleteMy husband refuses other options should IVF continue to fail (we have 4 failed cyles of ivf already). He would live child free at that point, he knows that I will not and will likely adopt a baby or an embryo on my own. It sucks.
Sending love your way.
How heartbreaking. I cannot even imagine what I would do in your position-- it's just so completely unfair, no matter which direction you go. Part of me wants to be really angry with Diver Dude for his part in this situation, but it must be incredibly difficult for him, too, to look at the person he loves and tell them that he doesn't want the same things that they do. I'm just so sorry you are going through this, and I wish you all the peace in the world as you figure out how to move forward, together or separate.
ReplyDeleteI feel your pain, not becuase I've been there, but because I know how it feels to know that whatever choice you make now affects your whole life..just like when you MET Diver Dude.
ReplyDeleteReading this I feel somethings, you are right about, love that fills you up and makes you smile is worth saving. That kind of love doesn't only come once in a lifetime but when it comes you need to hold onto it as long as you can..it makes you stronger and better.
but in other ways, I so want you to be a mom, I have only "met" you..but I know in my heart that motherhood would be like coming home for you. I don't know if you should have to give up that dream to have another with Diver Dude.
There are no words, no real advice, nothing we/I can say because this is your journey to take, your decisions to make..but I did want to write down that I believe you will be an incredible MOM whenever and however that happens...you need to keep that in your heart...as I go and wipe my tears for you.
HUGS, HUG, HUGS
Oh CP what a decision.
ReplyDeleteI really wish there was something that I could say to make it easier on you, or make the right decision clear to you.
I don't believe there is a "right" decision for this situation.
Each one will take you on a different path in your life.
That natural desire is a burning one and not something that can be put out.
I am praying for you.
Praying that some light comes into your life.
Praying that whatever happens, you will be okay.
Sending you all my love.
xo
I teared up reading this post, CP, because...gosh...this is absolutely heart-rending. It *is* an impossible choice. I hate that you're here, in this position, in this agony. I'm genuinely sorry. You have an amazing and resilient spirit, and I have this feeling that no matter which route you take you will find peace there. I'm thinking of you...
ReplyDeleteThat is such an impossible choice. I'm sorry that you have to go through this, and that you are faced with such a choice. I hope you find a way to decide, and that you can be at peace with that decision. Best wishes.
ReplyDeleteGosh girl, my heart breaks for you. What a difficult place you are in. I pray that you find the perfect peaceful answer to all this. Big hugs!
ReplyDeleteI don't know what to say. My heart aches for you. I could see a future where I might be faces with similar choices, and they are not easy ones. Please know that I am thinking of you and holding you in my heart.
ReplyDeleteOh Honey! I'm so sorry you are going thru this. I can't even imagine what this must feel like. I have been praying for you and will continue to do so. I have kept hoping that Lady Merlin would be able to get across to DD the pain your experiancing from the loss of not being a mother. He isn't going to actually be mourning anything if he doesn't have a child! You will! I hate to point the finger but if he loved you he wouldn't want to see you in this pain. I hope that your able to come to some resoultion. But don't give up CP! We love you and are all here for you!! No matter what you choose. Sending you lots of Love and Hugs!
ReplyDeleteOh sweetie -- I'm very sorry that you find yourself in this position. I wish I had advice for you or anything that could tell you what is "right" -- all I can do is echo the other women here and remind you that you are wonderful and strong and will survive whatever comes your way.
ReplyDeleteWhat an impossible situation. I had so much hope that Diver Dude would wake up one day and decide that he wanted to do this for you - for both of you. I have no idea what to say, except to let you know that I'm thinking of you and really hope you can work through this, in the best way possible.
ReplyDeleteI was once in your position and chose to stay, because I saw no other option. In hindsight I should have left, then and there, instead I stayed and slipped even deeper into the depression that had already started to surface.
ReplyDeleteIt is impossible to now what to do, follow your instincts and your heart!
Can you keep living in limbo like you have lately?
Can your therapist offer some advice?
Honey, if I had known what I know today, I would have left once I understood that I couldn't live w/o trying to have kids!
Having an unfulfilled yearning will eventually kill your love for DD, unless you REALLY learn to accept being w/o kids… I know I couldn't do it - I have already proven that.
I think of you daily, and now that I'm pregnant again I also feel a little guilty!
I don't even know what to say, but know that I am thinking of you and praying for you. You are right, this is an impossibel decision and it's one that I truly wish that you didn't have to make.
ReplyDeleteI'm so sorry - what a terrible choice for you to make.
ReplyDeleteWould he consider parenting a child with you that you conceived via donor IUI? Is it that he does not want more procedures, or that he does not want to share the responsibilities of a child?
I don't know...just wondering if maybe there are more options in there for you. If he truly loves you as much as you love him, then it shouldn't be a choice between the two biggest desires of your life, and he'll work with you to find a way to have it all. - Tkeys
Wow, I really just don't know how to respond, I am at a loss for words. I can not imagine how exhausting this back and forth between hope and loss must be on you. it sounds like you have an amazing relationship, but for many woman being a mother is just something that we have to do.....it's a biological thing. I wish more then anything I had some sort of answer for you, or advice, but I don't. Part of me thinks that he should not want to deny you something that you need in your life to feel whole, but then again I don't know the whole situation. There was a woman in one of my postnatal fitness classes that had a similar situation. She decided to get pregnant with a donor AND stayed married to her partner who did not want to have any children. I'm not exactly sure how that worked, but it worked for them.
ReplyDeleteI'm so sorry. My heart is breaking for you. When I first realized I wanted children, my DH was sure that they weren't in his future plans. I did a lot of soul searching and knew deep down the reason I so badly wanted children was because I wanted them with him. Without him in my life the longing for children would have disappeared. I am so sorry that you find yourself in this position. I hope that with some reflection and time you and DD are led to a place where you are able to be true to both of yourselves. My thoughts are with you.
ReplyDeleteOh, I am so sorry, my heart is breaking for you. Like many of the others, I am not sure what to say except that I am thinking of you. Give it some time, think about it, talk about it and hopefully a feeling(s) will guide you. Is it a possibilty to take sometime away from DD to think? I know that may not be what you want but it may help to provide some clarity.
ReplyDeleteOh, all I can do is send many huge *hugs* and hope for you. I know this impossible choice all too well - I have a similar one that I don't blog about. If you ever need anyone to talk to (outside of blogging of course), please email me at ayariaATgmailDOTcom.
ReplyDelete*hug* *HUG* *hug*
(beautiful pic - I love it)
Oh my dear, my heart aches for you. I wish so much that this was different and I can't even begin to imagine how impossible this is. I am holding you in my heart and sending good thoughts in your direction.
ReplyDeleteOk I’m going to be the voice of difference here.
ReplyDeleteYou have to step back and weigh up what you have now verse what you may OR may not have in the future dependant on choices.
In your left hand is what you have now, a wonderful life with a man that you love completely and truly with your whole soul and being. An all consuming, all encompassing love. A love that gets you through the ups and downs of marriage.
In your right hand is nothing but maybes. So if you leave DD and get donor sperm you MAY get pregnant but you also MAY NOT. Say you DO get pregnant with donor sperm; great you have your much longed for child but what have you lost? If you don’t manage to get pregnant, then you not only don’t have the child but you also don’t have DD – double loss and no wins.
You say that because DD is older than you, you will probably be a young widow and be alone. Nothing in life is certain, YOU may die before DD, you may die together or yes DD may die before you. If you have child alone, yes you will have that love of the child but come 18, there is a fairly high chance that the much longed for child that you had left DD to have, will be spreading their own wings and leaving the nest....leaving you – yep you guessed it, alone.
I have read the comments attached to this post and I really have to comment on some of them....
I agree that NOT having a child will result in mourning the thing you want and not being able to have it – hell I’m doing that right now so I KNOW it will and does happen. However, if DD says yes to having a child and actually doesn’t want one, then he may mourn for the life that he wanted but didn’t get because he agreed to have a child when he perhaps didn’t really truly want one. I have an issue with something Mrs Farmer said - you say if DD loved CP then he wouldn’t want to see her in this pain – how about we reverse that and say if CP loved DD, then she wouldn’t have to nor want to convince him to do or have something that he’s already admitted in his heart he doesn’t want.
Tishi
“Part of me thinks that he should not want to deny you something that you need in your life to feel whole, but then again I don't know the whole situation.”
But should CP want to force something upon DD that he obviously does not want?
You both love each other, that isn’t in doubt, however you both want something completely different. Neither of you want to give up what you want, so you either have to come to a compromise or be prepared to walk away to find what you want either with other people or alone.
I read your post AND the comments out to Bikerman and the first thing he said was “why does DD have to be the one to compromise on what he wants? Why is it always the man?”
This comment isn’t written in a nasty way – so please don’t take it like that. It’s written to try and let you see things from a different angle. I’m not one for following the sheep and telling people what they want to hear, I would rather tell people the truth (as I see it) and let them do what they want with it.
I, like Kari who posted further up, never wanted children until I met Bikerman. HE is the reason why I want children, if I was with anyone else or even alone, I wouldn’t want children, he makes me want to be a mother so we can have children together. That isn’t going to happen now, 8 miscarriages have seen to that and so I’m readjusting to life with just Bikerman and I.
Is our life going to be what I’d hoped it would be when we got married? No. Is our life going to be fabulous, filled with loved up moments and spontaneous things decided at the drop of a hat? Absolutely!
Only YOU will know if you can be happy with just you and DD for the rest of your lives, if your love for each other is enough but I’m here to tell you that, if you decide that it is, that life can still be wonderful – just in a different way.
xxxx
My heart is just breaking for you right now. I will pray that guidance comes to you as well to him. Hang in there.
ReplyDelete((((hugs)))))
ReplyDeleteyour impossible choice is one of my deepest fears.
ReplyDeletebut if this journey has taught me anything, it is that i am stronger than i ever would have guessed. may you find comfort and peace in whatever path you choice.
I am so sorry this is the decision you have to make. I wish you peace.
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry too.
ReplyDeleteI have to agree with Miss Ruby about giving up dreams - if you both have incompatible dreams, either one of you having to give up your dream is tragic and equally sad.
Unfortunately, it seems as though DD is willing to give up your relationship to keep his dream, and it puts you in the position of having to know that his "dream" of his relationship with you is less important than the childless dream. That must really hurt.
I don't know if this will help, but your post and the comments make me think 2 things:
First, know yourself. I don't know if I could give up a dream and not be resentful, and destroy whatever trust and love there was in the relationship - hopefully if you decide to give up your dream you will be able to be happy.
Second, everyone talks as though being alone is the worst possible thing. Can you imagine a scenario in which you are alone in 20 years and are happy? What do you have to do and what are the choices you have to make to get there?
Dear CP,
ReplyDeletesorry that life doesn't live up to our dreams.. I guess no one really dreams of finding a man with children, I didn't but just spend 5 years with my DP. Then, no one dreams of infertility but it has been the focus of the past years as well. With some things in life it helps to work towards what you really want, but I'm not sure the same goes for IF or love.
Rationally I would say stay and try donor sperm and see what happens, but emotionally I can only offer hugs and say that I'm as scared for you and DD as for me and DP.
Here from LFCA. As you say it's an impossible decision. I would give DD a bit more time to work through his "issues" and hopefully he'll change his mind moving forward.
ReplyDeletePerhaps if you explain it to him like you've explained it to us??
HUGS.
xxx
Here from LFCA. Loss and infertility seem to present us with a series of tough choices but this one is unimaginably difficult. I am so very sorry that you are in a position where you must even contemplate this, and I well understand that either decision is horrible in its own right, and filled with pitfalls. Thinking of you. And hoping that Diver Dude has a change of heart.
ReplyDeleteAw, shit. I wish I had something actually helpful to contribute here, but I don't. What Tamsen says above made me gasp a bit. close to the bone. My vision is clouded by my own desire for a child, but if I were out for drinks with DD, I would ask him to think about what it means to love you, and not love this part of you. I guess I might ask you the reverse, if I weren't so cloudy-eyed.
ReplyDeleteWhile I won't go so far as to advocate splitting from DD -- that was one heck of a love story you posted -- I remain unconvinced that the alternative is being alone forever. You seem like an immensely loving and lovable person. I'll stop there, as this tack seems machiavellian to me, but I'm sure you follow.
In conclusion, shitballs. No useful advice. But I hope you see the love and sadness for you in the rambling above.
I'm sorry this is the decision you are facing. I've been on lots of childless/free (not by choice and by choice) forums over the past almost-10 years, & this is a frequently posed question (although we don't always hear what the decision was & how things worked out). In some cases there are stepchildren -- in some cases, there is a great relationship and in others, not so great.
ReplyDeleteIt's a crapshoot -- stay with the man you love -- but with a great sense of loss & perhaps a tinge of resentment colouring your relationship -- or leave in the hope that you will either find another man to build a family with, or purue single motherhood -- with the caveat, of course, that you may or may not meet someone, and that pursuing fertility treatments may or may not work. SIGH.
Whatever you decide, I wish you eventual happiness.
Saw the news on LFCA. I wish there were an easy answer. There is so much uncertainty ... it's hard to live life on the basis of what *might* happen, and yet, you know in your heart if you are happy. Take time to care for yourself right now, and to live with whatever is in your heart. I hope that you find peace, whatever you decide.
ReplyDeleteComing from LFCA: I wish there was a magic crystal ball that would show you what was the future, which road to take. Unforunately, ther is only the choice. I am sorry you have to make such an impossible one.
ReplyDeleteI was in your shoes. Before we got married, before we were even serious, my boyfriend, now husband, and I discussed the fact that neither of us wanted to have children. But as time went on, and we had been married for about 5 years, events happened in my life that changed my perspective. I began to want to have not a baby or a child but a FAMILY, something more than just the sum of husband and me. But I love my husband so deeply, he is the only man I can imagine spending the rest of my life with, and I was in mourning. I didn't want to give him up, I didn't want to give up being part of a family. So I laid my torment at his feet and let him know what HIS choices were and where I stood. Luckily for me, for both of us, he decided to try a family life with me.
ReplyDeleteMiss Ruby and your DD are wrong in very many ways. Wanting a baby or a child isn't wanting a baby or a child alone. I am not a fan of babies, what I wanted was a connection between my grandparents, my parents, my siblings, my husband, AND me. The minute you bring a child into your life you have a family. It doesn't end when your child is grown, the love only grows bigger...when he falls in love or she has a child.
How nice that your DD has a family already. How does yours continue through your step children? Who will you sing the lullabies you grew up with to? Share your family traditions with? The problem with men is that they see what affects them immediately, not the long term. Your DD has dealt with the crying baby in the middle of the night, the sick kid that keeps you up, the worries and fears. There are very few men who say "Yeah, I'll take that on." No matter WHERE they are in their life. They aren't fathers for REAL until they have a baby in their arms, and then they wouldn't go back. Yeah, babies are hard, toddlers are hard...but they grow, and that time is brief. Your DD has already done it, but he should be able to come to a joint decision with you, not just lay his cards on the table and walk away. After all, he has already GOT it all. Can you imagine for a moment if you came to him and said "You can have me forever, but I expect you to give up all contact with your children forever and be only with me."? There is something about this that just doesn't sit well with me. I hope that you can at least sit down with him and lay your cards on the table, too. Fair is fair.
LFCA
This is a terrible choice. But if it were mine, I would choose Diver Dude. My pregnancy was so very hard, and our baby was INSANELY DIFFICULT for eight weeks. If I had had enough money to hire a full time nanny or house keeper, I might have been able to do it alone. Before I met my husband I had given up on finding love and had determined to get IUI with donor sperm. I had a car, and a condo, and access to 24 hour child care near my job. I was going to do it. But having had a baby the sheer logistics of doing it alone can be overwhelming. It can be done, with a good support system.
ReplyDeleteHow do you see yourself at the end of your life? You could roll the dice and end up with no baby, and no Diver Dude. Or you could roll them and have a baby and find love elsewhere in the years to come. I'll tell you the truth, my father remarried in his late fifties and I love my stepmother. I go to her for advice and help before I go to my Mom.
I don't think you have a wrong choice in front of you, just a very hard one.
Here from LFCA
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry that you have this decision to make. I have no advice for you - because it has to be your decision, but I hope that you take time to carefully consider the options. And most of all I hope that DiverDude, realises the awful place he has put you and starts to think again.
When I was TTC my then DH decided that he no longer wanted to try. I was devastated. I could not imagine my life without him and I could not imagine not being a mother either. But I knew that I would stay no matter what, I loved him and he was my "for sure". We had each other. He eventually changed his mind , we got pregnant, had a beautiful girl ... but the man I loved, that marriage I thought was the only certain thing I had crumbled before my eyes. I went from dealing with infertility to dealing with infidelity. Now I know that the only thing I know for sure is that I will be forever my daughter's mother. Don't stay just because this is the only thing you know for sure and motherhood seems so uncertain now. It is nice that he is being honest with you, but it terribly unfair . I don't know his reasons, thus I can judge but my question is : Would you deny him of something that really meant a lot to him???? How would he react to that?
ReplyDeleteHUGS. I hope that you can find an answer within you
(((hugs))) I desperately wish I had some answers, or at least some good advice. Unfortunately, this decision is yours to make, using your head, heart, and gut feelings. You are clearly in love with him, and I'm sure it's difficult for him to hurt you. I didn't read all of your blog (just this post), but perhaps talking to a counselor might help? A marriage counselor for both, maybe an IF counselor for you (and him if he's willing). This is truly a difficult choice, but from your post, it sounds like you really don't want to be without this man. I hope that there's a way you can both be happy in a decision. I wish you both the ability to handle whichever decision is made, and best of luck too.
ReplyDeleteI'm sending you love and light. xoxo
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry to hear that you have such a difficult decison to make. I have no idea what I would do in your situation. I hope that you find the answers and peace that you are seeking. LFCA
ReplyDeleteI'm so sorry you're faced with this decision. I have an extremely cynical bent, so I cannot in good conscience give you any advice. I hope you can figure out the best path for yourself and your future. Much luck.
ReplyDeleteHeartbreaking post. Thank you for being so open and sharing your story with us.
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